make it easy. would this be a thing if it was a bible?
I’m not pro book burning, here it will be interesting to see the ruling First suggested method is … burn it.
So the discussion could only be whether is was respectful, careful, safe and clean. (which are all subjective)
I’m not pro book burning
I am pro “people doing with their property whatever they fucking want” and i think putting religion in general on such a pedestal is ridiculous. Same with burning flags. Its just a dead object, it shouldnt have rights.
I’m not pro book burning, not anti book burning either
Its just a dead object,
True, but that’s not what angers people. It represent/stands for something, and that’s why they get pissed. Not the object itself.
It stands for oppression.
I think you’re missing the point. It’s never about just burning something. If the person would have burned the quran at home and people later found out and reported it it’s not going to be a legal issue.
It’s more a question of whether this counts as hate speech type action directly targeted at a group protected from discrimination such as lgbt, religion, race and whatnot. If I’m being honest, I think people shouldn’t be allowed to do this on stage in front of an audience while live streaming and I’m not sure where I’d draw the line either.
I think most people would agree that doing a fake hanging of doll that looks like a black guy on stage shouldn’t be allowed, or doing “Let’s burn the muslim” burning of a doll. That’s people doing whatever they want with their own property that is a dead object also. It’s not per se about burning the object, it’s about being hateful towards a minority on purpose.
Yeah no i 100% think that religion needs less protections. People need protections. People are not their religions, so if i make fun of islam or judaism, that is not and shouldnt be considered racist or hate speech. Religious people love crying about minority oppression, when in reality its always been religious people that have oppressed others.
Atheists, like me, have been very oppressed throughout history and it’s still illegal to be atheist in a bunch of places. You should absolutely be allowed to make fun of everyone of course and everyone should be given the benefit of the doubt. It’s just specifically this case of burning the Quran that can’t be considered anything else than being intentionally hostile towards muslims.
Should people be allowed to preach the Quran and the Bible? Pretty sure they are not very tolerant of other religions.
Absolutely yeah: freedom of practicing one’s own religion and congregate.
Absolutely no: crusades. Everything between is gray area, some almost black, almost white.
P.S. Quran is surprisingly accepting of christians since they accept jesus as a prophet, but not the son of god/is actually god stuff.
P.S. Quran is surprisingly accepting of christians since they accept jesus as a prophet, but not the son of god/is actually god stuff.
Pity I am not a Christian.
I am far more familiar with the Bible’s hatred since I live in a ‘Christian country’ but I can easily find some questionable quotes from the Quran.
And may punish the hypocritical men and the hypocritical women, and the idolatrous men and the idolatrous women, who think an evil thought concerning Allah. For them is the evil turn of fortune, and Allah is wroth against them and hath cursed them, and hath made ready for them hell, a hapless journey’s end.
And so for him who believeth not in Allah and His messenger - Lo! We have prepared a flame for disbelievers.
Allah promiseth you much booty that ye will capture
Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves.
I can see there is no doubt Allah is the Christian God.
I can waste my time and probably find more reprehensible shit, let alone in actual practice and history of Islam (or Christianity). It’s pointless if you really believe Christianity and/or Islam are tolerant and not fundamentally systems of manipulation of a unique scale and effectiveness.
Not debating religion good/bad, just pointing out a counterexample. I’m also an atheist.
With that logic a neo nazi can have his swastika and do whatever he want about it
No it’s more like; no one can hurt the feelings of the neo Nazi or they might freak out and murder innocent people.
This specific law can fuck off, but this specific act can also fuck off. Were you trying to start some shit? Intent is an important element, and it seems clear you were trying to start some shit.
Like if someone buys used books and tears out pages to start their fireplace, whatever. But if they specifically buy queer literature, and make a big show of burning it in public because it’s queer, and scream ‘fuck all queer people’ while doing it - that’s a different thing. The form of expression is secondary to what you are expressing.
In the US, there’s no legal difference between a march for voting rights and the KKK parading through a Jewish neighborhood. Guess how that’s going for us.
That act was meant to be provocative as a form of protest. Would they get the same reaction from burning a Bible or a Torah? That’s what they were trying to show I guess
Successfully starting some shit does not make the provocation better. It’s still someone shouting ‘fuck all minorities!’ to paint a strong reaction as retroactive justification.
And there’s a lot of places in Europe where burning a Torah to say ‘fuck all Jews!’ probably should get a strong reaction.
