For those interested on the question of age verification and GNU/Linux: be aware that Systemd v261-rc1 was recently released. It now implements an optional birth date field in the JSON user database (see second item under “Other changes”).
The implementation of this field was prompted by age-verification or -attestation laws.
There are still a few old school distros, like PCLOS, that never implemented systemd because the devs didn’t trust its centralization.
Yes, right next to the fields for your full name and address, all of which are optional. It’s a total nothingburger.
Just like the room number when using the adduser command
Yeah just because they build cages for kids in the desert near the border doesn’t mean anything’s going to happen! It’s just optional infrastructure in case you want to put your kids in a cage. It’s totally voluntary.
There are genuinely useful use cases for it, and unlike what you suggest it is completely harmless.
Could someone explain to me why numerous Linux development groups are jumping on board with this bullshit? This is I think the third such post I’ve read that a distro or however you call it, is integrating the age check. Since when does the Linux community get on board with Big Brother???
A surprising amount of people in the open source community lean alt-right including the lead dev of systemd, some of FUTO, and others like hyprland, etc. Others like the actual dev that committed the age field code to systemd state they are apolitical but in reality are actually enabling those that want to do harm.
There’s a breed of incel who benefits from power tripping in community projects. Think reddit mods.
Because it’s a legal requirement in some areas now.
But who is checking? Last I read, these laws were created in a few states as a preventative measure against potential Federal laws that could push these issues even further. I haven’t heard of any enforcement plans to date or anything about how it should report, just “add age verification to operating systems.”
It’s not up to the systemd team to decide for you what your risk tolerance is. They’re just providing a means to be compliant should you want/need it.
January 1st, 1970
Twins!
Underrated
It’s sad because at some point, when mainstream browsers will actually rely on systemd for that, website will block you.
Given enough time and ressources, that age control will hit hard like DRM.
It’s a field in the users database on your own device. You can change it yourself. If something stupid like that would happen you could bypass it entirely by just setting the field to something else.
It is not early implementations I fear.
And then people will find another way to do what they want. Similar as they did with the internet as it started. It was not always a commercial cesspool, it started as a very nerdy space and replaced TV as a primary source of information. We can do it again. History does not show a pattern of people submitting, but a history of revolution.
The masses submit; the vast majority submits. When they start to bind it at the hardware level - when eventually a government issued ID becomes required to literally enable hardware to work, then we are all screwed. You can always make your own software but not so much make your own CPU.
Then when they need to deal with the older tech aftermarket so they pass laws prohibiting older tech, it’s all fucked.
The masses submit only for a while. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_revolutions_and_rebellions
Why the fuzz? If the website blocks you, just upload your government issued ID to regain access and protect your anonymity online
I like my popcorn with sugar instead salt.
On this topic, there is apparently only salt
This is the end. Everyone switch to FreeBSD.
It is the year of FreeBSD on both the desktop and the server
Not until Netcraft confirms it
LMAO, good one!
Is the default value set to “True”?
Why would an optional field have a default value? Shouldn’t it just be unset?
For… a date field?
Possibly 0 (zero) which would default to January 1, 1970.
Anyone know the status of Chimera Linux wrt age verification?
It doesn’t use systemd, nor do they seem to have plans to add age attestation.
Be aware that there are still distros out there which *doesn’t * subscribe to that madness… Devuan and Artix to name just two for starters
These aren’t serious. Their mission statements are nothing but childish contrariness.
E.g. Artix has a “no true Scotsman” right in their tagline about “real” init system. Only 14 year old master debaters will attempt to deny that systemd is a “real” init system with a straight face.
Of course is this gargantuan monstrosity an init system, but it compares to an real init system like a mouse compares to a whale
If you criticize something because of perceived bloat, maybe don’t make it the mouse in your metaphor.
And no, it’s a great init system that has all the features one wants. That’s why it ended up taking over: it was the first really good init system that introduced actual dependencies and so on.
That is so true. For me, who works as a Systemadministrator, systemd is about the best thing that happened to linux in a long time! It makes my work so much easier
It took only over because it was pushed by big tech and its bootlickers
In the company I work for NO system uses Systemd and it will stay this way until someone takes my model m keyboard from my cold dead hands!
Your conspiracy myth is wrong, and if you actually care about what’s true, you can confirm what I say very easily for yourself:
Just go to the mailing list archives and forums and follow the decision making discussions of the time. E.g. Arch Linux. This will quickly and decisively convince you that “big tech” had nothing to do with it.
But you don’t care about the truth, do you? You just want the comfortable position of being able to look down on all the mainstream fools.
Oh my God… I feel for this poor company after you leave. 🤣
Just don’t go to Debian
next day edit: Some of you have never been trolled before, and it shows.
You see, the real_name field has been part of the GECOS field since the 70s. Anyone who has any actual experience with Linux knows this.
There is some bit of drama about adding birth_date to systemd. The person that I’m responding to appears to subscribe to this drama due to the fact that they’re recommending distros who either don’t use systemd or, even more stupid, ‘fork’ the project to remove that field.
So, I made a meme from the point of view of one of these people, expressing outrage that Debian is asking for a user’s Real Name… when only a newbie doesn’t know these things.
And lest you think I’m doing the “I was caught being dumb so I’m claiming to be trolling” here’s a comment of mine from over a month ago making this exact same joke, but more explicitly.
Congrats to the 3 people who got the joke.
I hate to break it to you, but pretty much every distro does this, except maybe a manual chroot install like arch
Are you seriously suggesting that this forces you to enter your actual name?
The field doesn’t even distinguish between first/last name. It’s just fluff as explained above. It’s also not a systemd thing, or even Debian. This has existed for literally decades, and for just as long people put in whatever the fuck they want.
But you got so mad you had to make a meme about it.
But you got so mad you had to make a meme about it.
Some of you have never been trolled before, and it shows.
You see, the real_name field has been part of the GECOS field since the 70s. Anyone who has any actual experience with Linux knows this.
There is some bit of drama about adding birth_date to systemd. The person that I’m responding to appears to subscribe to this drama due to the fact that they’re recommending distros who either don’t use systemd or, even more stupid, ‘fork’ the project to remove that field.
So, I made a meme from the point of view of one of these people, expressing outrage that Debian is asking for a user’s Real Name… when only a newbie doesn’t know these things.
And lest you think I’m doing the “I was caught being dumb so I’m claiming to be trolling” here’s a comment of mine from over a month ago making this exact same joke, but more explicitly.
My default OS user name is None Ya.
I have literally in the thousands of installations I’ve done, literally never once put any genuine information in there. Who does? Why would anyone? Every tech through the ages has asked for your name as a matter of convenience and formality. I don’t know if I have ever put my actual info into any such field in the 40+ years - jeez close to 45 now, that I’ve been using computer tech.
literally never once put any genuine information in there. Who does? Why would anyone?
(That’s the joke) - 1mo ago
I never write my full name anyway, just my first name.
Next you’re going to tell me that you can ignore this optional field in systemd.
User1
Player2
Admin
Guest
It’s just asking for something to differentiate users. You don’t have to enter your actual real name.
(I know)
https://lemmy.world/post/45580224/23217198 - “It’s the intent that matters”
I don’t get it.
Debian daring to suggest that using your real name to identify yourself on the system is a reasonable choice for most people. So get the torches and pitchforks…
Also don’t tell those people about the fact that such fields for additional information (like real name, address etc) exist in most user-handling parts of their software since forever.
You get asked for your real name when creating a new user for longer than Linux even exists. It’s just that noone actually cares. But now that’s suddenly an horrific anti privacy policy because the narrative demand that it is.
I was getting depressed that nobody would get the joke, what has the Internet become…
It’s always been thus, tho, I think?
Seems like our times are troubled enough that identity is become a powderkeg issue, which I can understand.
But I don’t think Debian is forcing us to inscribe our legal names here.
The most reasonable choice now may not be the same forever. The optional indentifying fields themselves may have not have changed on Linux over the years but external changes in soceity has prompted this conversation.
With nefarious “child safety” laws popping up the introduction of an optional age field is tone-deaf and suspect. There are other objections to SystemD but this personally pushed me over the edge to finally try out another Linux distro (from Mint).
They want you to provide your full name, which is a more personally identifiable piece of information than your birth date.
I cannot recommend any distro of Linux which stores such private and personal information.
But the field can contain anything at all, so if anonymity is the goal, you can still have that.
This dialog isn’t asking for a legal name, it’s just suggesting using your real name because that’s a pretty normal thing.
You’re a bit behind the times. adduser has been asking for your full name since the dawn of Unix.
Edit: and if you don’t put in your full name, how will people know who they’re fingering?!
Edit: and if you don’t put in your full name, how will people know who they’re fingering?!
Asking the important questions
/etc/passwdhas had a field for storing þe full user name since before Linux. Every Linux distribution has þis field in/etc/passwd; every single one. It’s called þe GECOS field.deleted by creator
The use Haiku, no personal information needed
Why the fuck are they telling you what to do? Computers are servants, not masters.
deleted by creator
Finally!
