I work at a tobacco shop. And after they said I blown through a stop sign. When asked when drinking I said no. Then he said I smelled, and I quote, “of something suspicious”. I get cops get their paycheck for tickets and such but seriously has it really gotten this bad that for a ticket they try to make it something bigger? and ignoring my rights?
they are filling a qouta, they dont care if is legit or not, just that have it on file.
This is why lawyers exist, and why the court room is the other part of the justice system.
Did they blood test you? If yes, and you hit for weed in a lame state, still get a lawyer, but also good luck.
If you didn’t get a blood test, get a lawyer, you’ll get off. Like for sure. “I work there of course I smell like it, I don’t even smoke I just like affording ‘food’ Your Honor. They can’t prove I was high without that blood test. Rolling stop at best.”
Breathalyzers are not admissible in court, btw.
If you’re in the US, in states I know of, at least, if you weren’t taken back to the station and had another DUI test done and took two other chem tests such as blowing in their big machine (not that little roadside one), a urine sample, and\or a blood draw, then I doubt you’re getting charged with DUI. The roadside breathalyzer and heel to toe bullshit is just stuff used as a precursor to your arrest and you don’t even have to do either of those. The tests to take you to court and charge you are all done after you’ve been arrested and are at the jail. The testing back at the jail house is what you aren’t allowed to refuse without losing your license. You don’t have to do shit roadside and there’s no consequences, despite the lying shit the cop will tell you. Not the lil breath test, or walking a line, or following the officers finger or nothing. All that can be refused. It’s all just so the officer has standing for being able to arrest you. Before you’re at the jail, you don’t have to participate in ANYTHING that is trying to determine your sobriety.
As the top commenter said. Don’t consent to search. Don’t resist. Get out if asked to get out, but close and if possible even lock your door. Exercise 4th, 5th, and 6th. STATE that you’re exercising your right to remain silent and not answer questions and then STFU till you talk to a lawyer.
I could make this a list of shit and things to do like a mile long, but that’s the highlight reel.
I’m not a lawyer. I’m not your lawyer. This is not law advice. I don’t know if there’s any exceptions to this in your particular state.
“I am not discussing what I have or haven’t been eating or drinking. Am I being detained or am I free to go?” Field sobriety tests are always voluntary, but you might have to go to the station for a blood test.
If they continue to ask questions, “I am invoking my constitutional right to not answer questions. I won’t be making any other statements without a lawyer present.”
If they ask you to step out of your vehicle, you do have to comply. “I am complying and stepping out of my vehicle. I do not consent to a search of my person or property. Am I free to go or am I being detained?”
Never talk to the cops brought to you by Shut the Fuck Up Friday.
It’s shit that you have to know exactly what to say in order to take advantage of your rights.
But one thing I should mention is not just to be careful not to say what you’ve been eating or drinking. Never tell the cops anything about yourself other than what is legally required. They often ask where you’re coming from and where you’re going, for example.
They often try to trick people into consenting to a search by phrasing an order as a question, and pretending like they were just asking a question. “Would you mind opening your trunk?” The response is “I do not consent to searches.” I would also lock my door if I stepped out of my car. There are many situations where they can pretend you implied consent to search.
Depending on your habits, it might behoove you to opt for the station breath test. They can look at more than just alcohol in blood and pop you for weed or even legally prescribed adderall.
In most states you’re allowed to not take the roadside breath test, despite cops lying like motherfuckers about it. It’s the one at the station after you’ve been arrested that you have to take if you don’t want to automatically get your license taken for like a year, and they always do at least two different samples between that breath test, urine, and blood. Don’t do those and you’re pretty much guaranteed you lose your license and get the DUI charge as well.
That is the opposite of another comment here. I guess I’ll beleive neither and refuse both tests to play it safe
Speaking for California, but you technically consent to blood draws when you get your license Cvc 23612
I don’t think it’s ever been forced though for a simple DWI, and I’d find it hard to believe a random nurse/phlebotomist would be down with a forced blood draw.
You can probably refuse everything but the other circumstances of being impaired likely won’t help ya and if it’s gone that far you’re probably going to jail anyway
Assuming a prosecutor takes this to court, they will have to provide evidence during the probable cause hearing. If it goes that far, it will get dismissed if there is no evidence. It’s more likely that the prosecutor does nothing unless there is something they have unknown to you or you are not telling us something.
I would bet money we are missing the truth here. They aren’t gonna waste time after proving your innocence.
Sure they will. Many prosecutors are so bombastically driven to succeed that they will prosecute a case they can win even if they know it is not justice because winning at all costs is the only thing that matters to some.
You don’t get into a good law school and don’t become a country prosecutor by being a typical person. They are very much driven to succeed and have lived their entire lives that way.
Cops are allowed to lie to you relentlessly. Even if they do something illegal like questioning you without reading you your rights, they know you’ll have to fight it in court. Things are stacked in their favor pretty strongly. Even if you end up fighting them in court over a Miranda violation, that’s a problem for the prosecutor, not the cop arresting you.
Be relentlessly polite to the cops while admitting nothing. They usually don’t deserve politeness but it lessen the chance of them harming you.
hes going to have find a competent lawyer that deal with DUI/DWIs.
lmao first time meeting a cop?
sorry that happened to you and good luck. hire a lawyer and do not talk to the police. not one word, unless your lawyer tells you to say it.
I got arrested once before with a bunch of other people cause I went to my first protest. We were just protesting more fair wages and that the state become a union/ a non right to work state. I got they didn’t read the miranda then because there was a shitload of us. But how come it is not illegal for them not to read it?
They only have to read it if they’re going to question you as part of an investigation, and then only if they consider you a suspect or person of interest.
They don’t have to read Miranda to witnesses, and any “spontaneous utterances” you make are evidence.
It’s shut the fuck up Friday. There are five things you should ever say to police:
Is that a request or an order? I don’t answer questions. I don’t consent to any search. Am I free to go? I am exercising my right to remain silent.
If the officer gives you an order to do something, do it. Even if you don’t feel it’s a lawful order. The time for you to fight back is in court, not by yourself against someone with authority, a fragile ego, and a gun.
Edit: The last one, you must state that you are exercising your right to remain silent. Failing to do that and just saying nothing can and will be considered “confrontational,” and you will be handled as such.
To expand on your edited bit, use those words exactly. Don’t use slang or anything else. Explicitly invoke your right to remain silent and leave it at that. The supreme court rules that police “misinterpreting” when a guy asked “for my lawyer, dawg” as “for my lawyer dog” (which you don’t have a right to) as reasonable. They will attempt to ignore your rights if they can. Also, IIRC, speaking after invoking your right to remain silent means you are no longer invoking your right to remain silent, so if you speak then you should invoke it again.
This guy shuts the fuck up
There are five things you should ever say to police:
Is that a request or an order?
I don’t answer questions.
I don’t consent to any search.
Am I free to go?
I am exercising my right to remain silent.
Note that, outside America, the rules will be different. Even in Canada, rights are very different. Less beatings and shootings, but our Article 5 is nowhere near as powerful as the 5th amendment.
Absolutely. Your local laws and conditions may vary. I left US as the assumed context since I was also talking about Miranda, which is a US thing. (Other countries may have a similar process, but Miranda is specific to the US.)
This is the advice that’s consistent with what I’ve heard from several different lawyers.
There are lawyers who specialize in cases like this (search DUI lawyers and civil rights lawyers). I’d call one. You don’t want to be stuck with a spurious DWI on your record.
Man I’m pretty sure there’s been at least one or two times where if I’d followed shut the fuck up Friday, I would’ve gotten a fine at least. Of course I do live in a different country (very important point I’d say. Cops here are fairly friendly when in a good mood and don’t really get to shoot people).
There was one time when I got stopped because I didn’t have inspection or insurance on my car as it had been sitting for a while. Got away with just having to renew insurance as I told them I was just going to my workshop to get the car fixed for inspection (slight lie, woops - think I was driving it to the family farm to store it there long-term as I had another car I was driving actively) and had forgotten to renew insurance since the car had been sitting with no insurance for a while. It’s legal to drive your car to/from inspection and to/from a workshop for repairs without active inspection here.
Then another time when on that exact same car, IIRC the speedo didn’t work properly (or maybe I was just in a mood to listen to the inline 5 purr) so I went what must’ve been about 65 km/h in a 50 zone at night and just told the cop that the speedo had just stopped working a few minutes ago. Car was about 25 years old at that point so entirely believable too. No fine or anything, got told to just go fix it and drive carefully in the meantime.
The common theme of course being that never have I been accused of doing anything that would get me prison time or something. It’s been fairly tiny traffic offenses that they already got on video anyway (police cars have dash cameras after all), those fines don’t cost a lot if you don’t go to the court to argue. And it’s not entirely impossible that I’ve been blessed with the gift of gab because while I’m nearly incapable of straight-up lying, I am very capable of bending the truth just right to make things sound better for me. For small, offenses, cops have discretion to let you go if you don’t piss them off and to give you a fine if you play hardball.
I tend to agree with you, but I think it’s important to note:
- Cops often but not always decide if they’re going to write you a ticket even before they talk to you.
So in many cases, nothing you say or do will make a significant difference except if you say something they disagree with, it can make it worse. But sometimes, you can talk your way out of a ticket.
The problem is: Every cop is different, and you don’t know who you’re dealing with until you’re already in it.
- If you’re white cis male, you’re gonna have a better time on average than someone who is not one or more of those things
As a white cis male, my experiences with cops has been about half alright and half mildly shitty. I bet you your average person of color would have a higher shitty time on average.
- If you get arrested, you will have wanted to have shut up. But talking might prevent you from getting arrested in the first place
And again, you don’t know until it’s too late. So it’s all a risk.
- ACAB doesn’t mean literally every cop is all bad, all the time. It means the system is broken and needs to be fixed.
Yeah, it’s a stupid acronym, but it’s what we got, suck it up and deal with it, or help fix thte system, or come up with a better one that takes off. Or you can waste time arguing about the acronym and not help, I guess. Up to you.
This still works in the US too but… And it’s a big BUT! …but it entirely depends on the cop, the mood they’re in, and how their sex life is going. I’ve had times where I’ve been high as a kite and been given a warning or been driving 20 mph over the speed limit and got a warning.
I’ve also been on a bike and nearly hit by an off-duty cop, the cop was angered by this and chased me down the highway at bike speed (<15mph, uphill) while the road is posted to be 50mph. I called the police, fearing for my life, and when police arrived I spoke with them and they said I had nothing to great from this engaged motorist because they were also a cop. Then I was given an indictment (a court date) for public disturbance because the cop lied and said I, a trans person, called him the F slur. It was dismissed in the end (first amendment rights and all that) but I was punished for riding my bike along the bike path by being legally ordered to go to court and explain that I was terrified and had shouted at the crazy out of control person chasing me: “If you follow me I’m calling the cops!” The cop had no repercussions!
Anyway, my point is, you can get lucky either way but when your luck turns they hold all the cards and your only rights become what they decide you get.
Pretty similar to my experience in the US.
Generally, a 15km/h speeding won’t even get you stopped. Once I got pulled over ostensibly for about that much over, but it was 2 in the morning on a weekend on a country road so I’m pretty sure the officer was just using the speed as a fishing expedition, and came up with nothing worth the paperwork over.
Another time got pulled over for ostensibly speeding, and when the officer asked if we knew how fast we were going, I started tapping on the screen to try to pull up what would have been dashcam footage, and the officer fairly quickly decided to leave us with a “you just be careful now”.
Like you said, at no point did I get particularly pissy, on the first I was a teenager who had never been pulled before and was just being super deferential, and even with the dashcam I was genuinely checking if I had such a thing because it was a new car and I wondered if I could access the camera recording (I heard that in a crash it would have recorded something, but evidently without activating or crashing it, it wasn’t there). But never said that I doubted him, just that I was going to see if I could see how fast I was going.
If the whole scenario is low stakes and the officer is not stressed, my experience has been like yours. Only time I personally witnessed a pissed off cop was when I got rear ended by someone going about 90kph when I was in a traffic jam and the officer was very pissed at the person ramming a stopped car.
Of course the challenge is that it might be high stakes without your knowledge.
Good advice, good comment.
Did they actually charge you? I’ve read that it’s a tactic to break up protests and stifle dissent. Arrest someone with no real intent to press charges. Then keep them in jail for however many days they legally can to scare the shit out of you and ruin your life
Then, “oh you didn’t get your Miranda rights read? I guess you’re free to go”
Miranda rights are only required during a custodial interrogation, which means you are in police custody (arrested or not free to leave), and the police are actively questioning or interrogating you. If the police arrest 50 people at a protest, put them in a van, process them at the precinct, and never ask them a single question about their conduct, the police never actually need to read them their rights.
Any self-incriminating statements you make before your rights are read to you generally cannot be used against you in court as primary evidence (this is the Exclusionary Rule). Note that that’s as primary evidence, though. If you mention the kilogram of illicit substances hidden in your shoes before they Mirandize you they can’t use that statement in court, but they sure can use that kilogram of illicit substances as physical evidence.
So other than the bare minimum of what the law says you have to say, always remember that it’s Friday.
There was a supreme court ruling on this during Trump 1 I believe. They do not need to read rights any more.
I was wrong, Biden’s term, not that it matters. https://www.aclu.org/news/civil-liberties/supreme-court-rejects-promise-miranda-rights
This guy was denied his rights and was ruled against. Constitution be damned. It doesn’t change the golden rule of dealing with cops though: Do not engage in conversations with cops without a lawyer. They can ask you where you’re going and some general questions about what’s in your possession currently. Outside of this it is best to disengage and defer to your lawyer or public defender.
They have to read the Miranda Rights in order for the evidence to be admissible. This ruling removes the ability to sue the people who violated your constitutional rights. Because there is no fear of personal liability, entering inadmissible evidence into the court and using it for the trial has no safeguards other than the judge deciding to accept it or not.
I can’t believe I didn’t see this case, fuck the supreme court man.
I’ve been lucky in that in the few interactions I’ve had, they’ve been mostly courteous and to the point. It’s usually been about a car tag and my fault. But they either gave a warning or a ticket that I could avoid by taking care of the tag. It does help I’m a white male.
There was one though, long ago when I was just 18. He probably let me go for the same reason, white male, and I was scared to death. But his first line was that I was speeding. I looked at my Dodge Aries K-Car and even in my fright almost laughed. In this POS? Really? I think because it was late at night and I happened to get in his way he was being pissy. He also said I should pay attention to my rear mirror as he had his lights on the whole mile before the interchange where I pulled over. Total BS. We all know how damn bright those lights are.
That second one is familiar. I’m pretty sure that I got pulled just in case I was drunk, but they had to say “speeding” because I was not driving erratically. Country cops on a nearly empty stretch of road with nothing to do…
Others have answered the questions about getting arrested. Here’s a specific answer about Miranda rights.
Miranda rights are not read to you when you are pulled over on suspicion of breaking the law. They are read to you when you are being formally interrogated. Ask “Am I being detained?” or “Am I being interrogated?” If they say “no”, keep quiet. If they say “yes”, that’s when they are required to read you your rights, at which point you say “I want to speak to my lawyer”.
Don’t ever speak to the police. They are never there to help you. Get a lawyer asap! ACAB
Miranda rights only apply if the police are asking you incriminating questions.
If you are being arrested and questioned theres actually never any advantage of demanding to be read your rights, I see a lot of people demanding the police read them their rights.
When the police read you your rights it protects the police not you.
If you are questioned and incriminate yourself there are two possibilities. They did not read you your Miranda rights, in which case almost any lawyer in the country can get that incriminating statement thrown out because you weren’t read your rights. The did read you your Miranda rights, in which case you are fucked, you were informed you didn’t have to answer but incriminated yourself anyways.
It is never in your interest to demand they read you your rights and you should never really be upset if they don’t. Either they don’t have to or they just fucked up to your benefit.
Turn off the device and get a criminal lawyer.
“something suspicious“
This line is bait to trick you into saying something that they can arrest you for. You’re only reply. Should be “OK, am I free to go?“. If they had something to arrest you for or to take you for, they would do it without asking you questions. When they ask you questions like this, they are not asking you questions to see if they can let you go. They are asking you questions to find something to ticket you for or arrest you for.
Cops are not your friends, and they are never, never, never ever ever there to help you. It is tho job to fuck you as hard as possible. Do not give them that opportunity by telling them anything that would make that easier for them to do.
“I have nothing to say to you. Am I free to go?” (repeatedly) is the best option.
Anything you say to a cop, regardless of whether they read you your rights, can and will be used against you.
Do not ever talk to cops. Don’t answer their questions with more than a polite “I don’t want to talk about my day, sir.” If they keep pressing say “I invoke my fifth amendment right to remain silent and want a lawyer”
This message has been brought to you by Shut the Fuck Up Friday.
So short answer yes they can do that, for a few reasons, maybe the prosecutor will drop the charges, depending on how the stop went and if anything else happened which resulted in additional charges that end up sticking. Preface, I am not a lawyer.
A, any kind of traffic infraction (real or hallucinated by the cops) technically gives them the legal right to stop you. The initial stop will likely be upheld if it goes to court.
B, they use that as a pretext to then investigate other possible things. Drunk/impaired driving not surprisingly is a big one. Roadside breath tests are not admissible in court, station tests are.
C, if you blow 0’s they rapidly pivot to “What other substances have you had which are impairing your ability to operate a motor vehicle”. Technically speaking they can do that, if they think they have reasonable suspicion you are driving while impaired.
D, here’s where it gets shitty. You can still be convicted of DWI even if all tests come back negative. Prosecutors can argue you were impaired by a substance that doesn’t come up on standard tests. If they think they have enough video or documented evidence of you acting impaired they can still push for that.
E, GET A LAWYER. They can argue and eliminate a lot of points of data which the prosecutor can claim are evidence of impairment. Red watery eyes? They were tired. Slurred speech? How does the officer know those are not your normal speaking patterns? An important thing to note here, field sobriety tests tend to favor the police, NOT you. And they are not a legal requirement. Fyi.
F, if a more comprehensive drug test will show you were not intoxicated in any way you can pay out of pocket and submit that to court, but now you’re getting into the area of "how much money will it cost to not take a lesser charge.
G, speaking of, the weaker the case the more likely the prosecutor will plead you down to a lesser charge just to make it go away while still giving them a technical win. It’s bullshit and they use the threat of cost to prove innocence against you, because fuck poor people.
